WEBVTT 00:00:02.000 --> 00:00:17.000 All right, so today's Queer Theology Sunday School is about including one another in beloved community even in the midst of not knowing all the details of all the education we could learn about. 00:00:17.000 --> 00:00:29.000 Each person's identity and all the colors of the the rainbow flag. But before we delve into that, I want to begin with 3 reminders about some more general basics. 00:00:29.000 --> 00:00:39.000 And this may be familiar to those of you who have attended past gatherings, but I really think it's good for Theo poetics to reiterate. 00:00:39.000 --> 00:00:45.000 These liturgies and sort of let them sink into our bones. So here's some reminders. 00:00:45.000 --> 00:00:54.000 Or maybe for some of you some good news. About our complicated world, our complicated God, and our complicated bodies and identities. 00:00:54.000 --> 00:01:02.000 So in the theme of Sunday school, I have a felt board here. And the reminder number one. 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:07.000 Has the symbol of a kaleidoscope. 00:01:07.000 --> 00:01:14.000 And the kaleidoscope is a non-binary way to imagine all kinds of things. 00:01:14.000 --> 00:01:19.000 The world is not built off of binaries. There are as many genders as there are people. 00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:27.000 There is day and night, but also dawn and dusk. Twilight overcast days. 00:01:27.000 --> 00:01:36.000 Eclipses and noon on the equator. There is land and there is water. And there is mud. 00:01:36.000 --> 00:01:43.000 There are tide tools and swamps. Bogs and land covered in ice, which is actually water. 00:01:43.000 --> 00:01:52.000 Creation is complicated. And we are part of creation. Got contains all genders and is genderless. 00:01:52.000 --> 00:02:08.000 As a preschooler once reminded me. You can use any pronouns for God. Even a spectrum contains the binary of its 2 poles and so I offer you the symbol of a kaleidoscope. 00:02:08.000 --> 00:02:18.000 Reminder number 2. Gender and sexuality are mixed up with power. So we're gonna put a star burst here to represent power. 00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:29.000 Queer theology is good news for all people not just queer people because it explodes the categories that hetero patriarchy is built upon. 00:02:29.000 --> 00:02:36.000 And hetero patriarchy puts unhealthy limitations. Onto the identities and behavior of all of us. 00:02:36.000 --> 00:02:44.000 Including straight cisgeered men. It's a damaging power hierarchy. That interrupts our ability to thrive. 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:54.000 Through the blessings of mutuality. Vulnerability and interdependent relationship. I invite you to think about those as forms of power. 00:02:54.000 --> 00:03:06.000 We create a radical sideways space here together rooted in the teachings of Jesus. Let us be aware of the way each of us handles power in this space. 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:15.000 Listen well, speak up. Seed the floor use eye statements and encourage a balance of voices and perspectives. 00:03:15.000 --> 00:03:24.000 Let's honor the vulnerability each of us brings today just in showing up at an event about queerness and spirituality. 00:03:24.000 --> 00:03:28.000 So the star burst represents power. 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:32.000 Reminder number 3. 00:03:32.000 --> 00:03:46.000 Spiral is a symbol of the constant unfolding of God. We did not invent queerness, interdependence, multiplicity, and the other ideas queer theology is based upon. 00:03:46.000 --> 00:03:56.000 We are following the leading of our Creator God who planted these ideas into the very realities of our bodies and the very fabric of our universe. 00:03:56.000 --> 00:04:06.000 So let us welcome our tenderly intimate and vastly unknowable God into this space. Where they have already been networked in you. 00:04:06.000 --> 00:04:12.000 Me in the air we are breathing even before this gathering began. 00:04:12.000 --> 00:04:25.000 So the spiral represents. The constant unfolding of the Divine. If you will, I invite you to breathe and pray with me. 00:04:25.000 --> 00:04:35.000 Spirit. Guy us as we open ourselves to seeing the world in different ways. Strengthen us. 00:04:35.000 --> 00:04:46.000 To grow and change our ideas. To accept ourselves more radically. To embrace the differences between each other more beautifully. 00:04:46.000 --> 00:04:51.000 To catch a glimpse of your vision of freedom for us. Thriving for our churches. 00:04:51.000 --> 00:05:00.000 And wholeness for this world that you love. Spirit. Breathe through us today as we seek you. 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:07.000 In our learning and our reflection. Amen. 00:05:07.000 --> 00:05:14.000 Okay, I'm excited now to welcome today's speaker, Madison McLendon. She, her pronouns. 00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:22.000 Who is a graduate of Ferman University and the University of Chicago Divinity School. Where she received a Master of Divinity in 2012. 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:30.000 She attends North Shore Baptist Church in Chicago, Illinois. Where she currently serves as moderator and has past roles. 00:05:30.000 --> 00:05:40.000 Sharing both the English worship ministry and a task force for renovating the sanctuary. She has served on the Board of the Baptist Joint Committee for Religious Liberty. 00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:50.000 The Baptist Peace Fellowship of North America. And the Association of Welcoming and Affirming Baptist, which is like the LGBTQ. 00:05:50.000 --> 00:05:53.000 Caucus thing for the Baptist. Interfree time she loves cooking, reading, playing retro video games from the 90, s and she lives in Chicago. 00:05:53.000 --> 00:06:04.000 So take it away Madison. Thank you for joining us. 00:06:04.000 --> 00:06:16.000 Thank you so much, Rachel, for the introduction. I No, a small number of people who are with us today and that's exciting to see those faces and and to see new faces as well. 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:23.000 So I did, I wanted to just jump right in. And I thought I would start by sharing a little bit of essentially. 00:06:23.000 --> 00:06:35.000 Personal testimony. I think I'm going to talk a little bit about personal testimony in a second. On personal story and why it's important in these conversations about what we know and what we don't know and how we accept. 00:06:35.000 --> 00:06:44.000 And so I thought I would start with a little bit. Of my own. And, and just share that when I was a child. 00:06:44.000 --> 00:06:55.000 With precocious religious questions my mother a minister in the Baptist tradition If not have a lot of time. 00:06:55.000 --> 00:07:04.000 There are a lot of pastors in this room. And so I think you probably understand what I mean when it say did not have a lot of time. 00:07:04.000 --> 00:07:15.000 And so I would come to her with questions. And she would do her very best to answer them. But when she ran out of time, she would say, here. 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:28.000 Read this book. And she would give me books from her library. And so, you know, I read, Yaroslav Pelicon in middle school and the history of the church. 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:47.000 I read, books by Marcus Borg. On the on the sort of far left spectrum I read more orthodox kind of understandings of the history of the life of Jesus from in T right and I'm really sort of came of age. 00:07:47.000 --> 00:08:00.000 In a faith tradition. Surprised knowing. That prize knowing. It prized understanding things before claiming them. 00:08:00.000 --> 00:08:10.000 It prized creating logical ways to comprehend our lives. It really did. Put on a pedestal. 00:08:10.000 --> 00:08:22.000 The act of academic learning, the act of reading books, the act of understanding things, knowing things. Articulating things only after taking the time. 00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:34.000 To deeply understand. And they're good things to be for that to be sure. But there's also weaknesses to that approach. 00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:44.000 Weaknesses I really I think started to understand as I left undergraduate and started. At the University of Chicago Graduate School, Divinity School. 00:08:44.000 --> 00:08:51.000 I know some of you may know that institution. I love it very much. I work for it now. 00:08:51.000 --> 00:09:02.000 In alumni relations and development. And so I have a strong stake in its support, but it is absolutely a place. 00:09:02.000 --> 00:09:10.000 Where the life of the mind is the first and foremost thing. What we feel in our bodies. 00:09:10.000 --> 00:09:21.000 What we understand in our hearts. How we comprehend things before we understand them. How we choose to make an action. 00:09:21.000 --> 00:09:29.000 Before we understand the theory. These are all things that you Chicago can have big blind spots in and really any elite. 00:09:29.000 --> 00:09:42.000 Academic institution can have blind spots. And so one of the things that I've worked on in my life is becoming more comfortable. 00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:57.000 With taking action. Extending my heart. And sharing my compassion even if I don't understand fully what's going on for another person. 00:09:57.000 --> 00:10:07.000 Because one of the things that I think the more I've read scripture, the more I've worked with scripture, the more I think it truly is one of the Okay. 00:10:07.000 --> 00:10:14.000 Counters that the life of Paul and the testimony of Paul especially have to offer to certain kinds of Greek philosophy. 00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:27.000 I if you're familiar at all with Socrates, Socrates entire thing. Was that if you knew what the good was, you wouldn't, it wouldn't be possible for you not to do it. 00:10:27.000 --> 00:10:39.000 Socrates believed that if you had a sense in knowledge and understanding of what it meant to be good or do good or see good things, it would be impossible to act counter to it. 00:10:39.000 --> 00:10:53.000 In any way. And I don't think that's what Paul says. I think of Paul in Romans especially where Paul says in Roman 7 quite clearly that he He doesn't understand his actions. 00:10:53.000 --> 00:11:02.000 He doesn't know what he wants, but he does what he hates. And he doesn't do, he doesn't do what he wants to do. 00:11:02.000 --> 00:11:14.000 He does what he, he would rather not do. And trying to comprehend what that means is I think a critical part of what one of the things that Paul is saying counter to the Greek tradition. 00:11:14.000 --> 00:11:32.000 That the only source of truth for us is not solely our logic. It's not solely our . That's only our ability to to add and subtract it's not solely our ability to reduce language and interpersonal relationships to a series of math problems. 00:11:32.000 --> 00:11:39.000 It's something richer and deeper and more complex with the whole range of different kind of motivations. 00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:46.000 And for Paul it really becomes, I mean, Paul's entire story, life story is based on personal testimony. 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:50.000 Why is he even allowed to be in apostle? He never walked alongside Jesus. 00:11:50.000 --> 00:12:04.000 His entire story and his entire claim to authority in the New Testament. Stems from the idea of his personal testimony of a faith experience. 00:12:04.000 --> 00:12:20.000 That convicted him beyond all logic and reason. To change the way he behaved. And so I really wanted to open us today with that story of my own kind of journey because I wanted to talk a little bit about testimony and experience as a source of truth. 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:29.000 I was thinking, you know, I was getting ready for, essentially, as a Baptist. 00:12:29.000 --> 00:12:46.000 Rachel had told me that it's easier sometimes to promote this event when we can say free church traditions and and share some of those commonalities between us and so I was thinking about the tree church tradition and one of the things that just occurred to me was thinking about the martyrs mirror. 00:12:46.000 --> 00:13:01.000 And all the stories in the martyrs mirror about people who suffered and worked and Bled and died throughout Europe for the sake of the radical proposition. 00:13:01.000 --> 00:13:15.000 That freedom in the church mattered. That what we what we chose to do as people of faith mattered and the more I thought about the more I thought about that radical free church notion that we can we can believe. 00:13:15.000 --> 00:13:23.000 In front of the throne of grace. The way we believe. That when it comes when Christ is stands at the last judgment and asks me what I believe, I don't get to say what Rachel believes. 00:13:23.000 --> 00:13:47.000 I have to say what I believe. And I'm responsible for what I believe and if Rachel believes something else, I'm not responsible for it, Rachel, that all of that kind of way of thinking and it goes straight down from the individual into our communities, right? 00:13:47.000 --> 00:13:56.000 It goes to how we organize our churches. If if me and Rachel are at such loggerheads that we cannot form a church together. 00:13:56.000 --> 00:14:03.000 We formed them apart. We are, we have the freedom to move apart even as we have the freedom to move together. 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:13.000 We have the freedom to move in our own conscience. We have the freedom to develop our own personal stories and communal stories and that can get really messy. 00:14:13.000 --> 00:14:22.000 And the more I thought about that experience, that free church experience written in history and time. I was like this. 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:31.000 His queer experience. This is queer experience. As I have transitioned over the past year. 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:42.000 I have learned that the real truth of transition, which is that while there often are similarities among certain kinds of trans experience. 00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:55.000 They, every journey is different. I know people who have transitioned at 17. I know people who are transitioning now at 80. 00:14:55.000 --> 00:15:07.000 That alone is a difference even if there's Even if there's common ground. There are different griefs, there are different joys, there are different possibilities. 00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:18.000 In each one of these lives each one of these personal testimonies each one of these personal stories is radically different And when I'm in my group or my support group. 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:23.000 Sometimes I will say sometimes I'm at these groups. 00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:34.000 You're really old. Because there's a lot of 20 year olds in that room. There's a lot of 20 year old energy that I don't share. 00:15:34.000 --> 00:15:45.000 And I don't necessarily even understand anymore. I mean, there's generational differences too. I don't always get where these girls are coming from. 00:15:45.000 --> 00:15:58.000 Sometimes we finish up and it's time for the after group. How well would I just head out because like I don't feel a lot of commonality and a lot of understanding sometimes. 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:05.000 But like that doesn't have to change the fact that every one of these young women is someone I love and cherish. 00:16:05.000 --> 00:16:13.000 It doesn't change the fact that every one of these young women is someone who I can. 00:16:13.000 --> 00:16:23.000 Learn something from. It doesn't change the fact that there are stories here which can Both highlight my story that can challenge my story. 00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:41.000 That can enrich my story. That can help me understand myself better. And so when I talk about testimony, when I talk about understanding when I talk about, I mean, the bill for this particular program is you might not understand all the letters of the LGBTQ. 00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:48.000 And I've curtailed the acronym. It goes on for some time when you really start adding, in the notes. 00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:51.000 You might not understand asexuality, adding in the notes. You might not understand asexuality. 00:16:51.000 --> 00:16:58.000 You might not understand asexuality. You might not understand. Every aspect of the difference between bisexuality and pansexuality. 00:16:58.000 --> 00:17:07.000 And and beyond the sexuality and a lot of the different words. But one of the things that that I think we really can. 00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:16.000 Gain out of embracing our free church tradition embracing the fact that we don't have to understand each other to love each other. 00:17:16.000 --> 00:17:29.000 And that's where I wanna kind of pull us back to think a little bit about. First Corinthians 13 it's that famous you hear it at weddings all the time right that famous sort of pay into love. 00:17:29.000 --> 00:17:35.000 If I don't have love, I'm a noisy gong or a clanging symbol. 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:45.000 It goes on and on for a while. And usually it is usually they stop reading. At the end at the beginning of 8 they say love never ends and everyone smiles at the wedding and sits down. 00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:55.000 And you go on to the party. But there's a part in this that I really love that is a critical part. 00:17:55.000 --> 00:18:04.000 Of the text, which it's when it says that for now on this side of heaven We see in a mirror dimly. 00:18:04.000 --> 00:18:12.000 But then we will see face to face. Now I know only in part. And then I will know fully. 00:18:12.000 --> 00:18:24.000 Even as I have been fully known. And that is so critical, I think, to understanding how Christian churches need to approach queer experience. 00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:33.000 Because we don't see each other perfectly. And we don't see ourselves. Perfectly. 00:18:33.000 --> 00:18:44.000 We trust that God does. But we don't see God perfect. We there are so many ways that we do not see each other. 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:48.000 Fully, completely 00:18:48.000 --> 00:19:06.000 In the light of love and grace. Even with basic understanding. And so one of the things that I really want us to think about today is the way in which we are not on the far side of that knowledge growth. 00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:18.000 And why it's not important. Because one of the things Paul says in that whole Here where he talks about love is that Paul is making a claim. 00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:29.000 That it is precisely the end. Of First Corinthians 13 that requires The beginning. That is to say, we don't. 00:19:29.000 --> 00:19:39.000 Understand each other fully. We don't know. Where we're coming from. We don't know ourselves. 00:19:39.000 --> 00:19:49.000 We don't know each other. We don't see God clearly. And under those conditions. 00:19:49.000 --> 00:20:03.000 The only thing we have left is The only thing we have left. Okay. This is where I think Paul makes the claims against Greek philosophy I was talking about. 00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:15.000 That are most powerful. Because one of the things that I think Greek philosophy might encourage you to say is Okay, Socrates. 00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:28.000 I don't know what the good is. So why should I bother? Why should I try? Why should I even attempt to do what's good if I can't figure out if it's difficult? 00:20:28.000 --> 00:20:42.000 Especially for someone who's not. Sitting at the marketplace with Socrates. But is sitting in your house in the 20 first century or wherever you happen to be looking back on. 00:20:42.000 --> 00:21:00.000 An absolute I believe it was. Hydiger called it the slaughterhouse of history. And all the impossible cruelties that like we've still managed to do despite doing philosophy for. 00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:07.000 Thousands upon thousands of years. I think it's easy to look at all that and say, all right, Socrates, I'm throwing up my hands. 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:15.000 If we couldn't figure out in 6,000 years what the good is, why should I bother? Why should I try? 00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:25.000 Why should I engage? And Paul says, absolutely not. Paul says, there will come a time when we understand what good is. 00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:30.000 There will come a time. When God shows us who we are. God shows us who others are. 00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:42.000 God shows us who God is. And I Rachel, you were saying God has all pronounced, but I do think it's more biblical to say that God's pronouns are I me mine. 00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:51.000 Okay, just from the Hebrew perspective. But no, I think God will show us who God is. 00:21:51.000 --> 00:22:01.000 But until then. Really on this side of heaven. The operation that God enjoins upon the Christian. 00:22:01.000 --> 00:22:08.000 And that Paul highlights for us in Corinthians is love. And then you get into all kinds of questions, right? 00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:13.000 What, what is love? How do we show love? I think love is far more question than an answer. 00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:19.000 How do we love each other? But I think some of the first Corinthians helps us see what that looks like. 00:22:19.000 --> 00:22:27.000 Love is patient, love is kind. Love describes a kind of way we feel when we experience it. 00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:34.000 Belle Hooks has a lovely book where she writes about love at at length and she really adopts. 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:48.000 The approach of M. Scott Tech, which some may know from the road, less traveled. Where he makes the claim that love is the willingness to extend yourself for another person's spiritual growth. 00:22:48.000 --> 00:22:55.000 Love is a willingness to extend that kind of a sacrifice of yourself. For someone else's growth. 00:22:55.000 --> 00:23:05.000 And one of the reasons why this is really important to Bell hooks And why I think it's really important when we talk about using it in the context of Christianity and understanding queer. 00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:21.000 Theological needs and the and the needs of queer persons in light of Christian community. Is that it can be really easy, I think, to, and some people do say, well, It's not good to be clear. 00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:29.000 It's not good to be gay. It's sinful. And so for them, love becomes cruelty. 00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:39.000 Because they there's this argument they may that essentially telling another person like it is, is a kind of tough love. 00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:45.000 That will help them avoid the flames of hell or whatever they're concerned about that the person will face. 00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:54.000 And I think that gets it exactly backwards. And I think this is why Bell hooks understanding of what love is and why Paul's understanding of what love is is so important. 00:23:54.000 --> 00:24:02.000 Because this describes what love looks like when it's not abusive. When it's not controlling. 00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:10.000 When it's about someone else's gain and growth. And not about telling someone else what they must do or how they must be or how they must. 00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:20.000 Feel. When someone says things like that, the the classic Love the sin hate the center. Other way around hate the sin love the center. 00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:37.000 I think the argument is that you're not loving the center. If you create a world. Where that love is controlling, where that love creates demands, where that love ceases to be curious. 00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:46.000 That curiosity is critical because seeing in a mirror dimly is not an excuse to just give up. 00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:53.000 And not try to see one another. It's a hint that we don't always see each other correctly. 00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:59.000 And so this assumption that this person is just doing something correctly. And so this assumption that this person is just doing something wrong or doing something poorly. 00:24:59.000 --> 00:25:02.000 And so this assumption that this person is just doing something wrong or doing something poorly is the kind of assumption that doesn't pass the curiosity test. 00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:03.000 It doesn't ask. What it must be going on for this person and why they're behaving this way or why they're thinking this way. 00:25:03.000 --> 00:25:15.000 Why they're feeling this way. And so I think one of the things that really Paul helps us see. 00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:23.000 Paul helps us understand and and modern thinkers are helping us understand is that we can actually assess the character of love. 00:25:23.000 --> 00:25:30.000 And we can assess it in the sense of what it brings into people's lives. Is it bringing, is it bearing fruit? 00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:33.000 Is it believing in them? Is it hoping in them? Is it, is it rejoicing in truth? 00:25:33.000 --> 00:25:45.000 As opposed to wrong? Is it allowing things room to grow for themselves or is it insisting on its own way? 00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:53.000 In cruel kinds of ways. And so I think using these kinds of tools in our Christian toolkit helps us understand. 00:25:53.000 --> 00:26:08.000 Why understanding. Something is not a requirement for love. And how we can start thinking about love and ways that enable us to be curious about one another, to dream about each other, and to explore ourselves. 00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:22.000 I wanted to pull us back before we do a little exercise and I think when we do the exercise Rachel, I think we'll ask some questions about whether we want to do it in the big group or break into small groups, but I'll do that in a second because I want to leave plenty of time for us to think. 00:26:22.000 --> 00:26:29.000 About this exercise together. I do want to say a few words. I said talked a little bit about it. 00:26:29.000 --> 00:26:36.000 In terms of this idea of not knowing yourself. 00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:44.000 And I kind of want to conclude on this because I think it's 1 of the most important things to try to understand. 00:26:44.000 --> 00:26:57.000 And it's something that comes out of my own personal testimony. Which is to say. That sometimes the love you show to other people now. 00:26:57.000 --> 00:27:03.000 Whether you know it or not is going to be love you show to yourself in the future. 00:27:03.000 --> 00:27:22.000 And in my case, the reason I say that is because when my, Those of you who are trans or queer may have come across this terminology, those of you who are says gender or straight may also have, but it's common in trans communities especially may have come across the concept of the egg. 00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:27.000 I don't know if you know that. You don't have to wave your hand if you do. 00:27:27.000 --> 00:27:36.000 But, but the idea is, of a trans person as an egg before they transition. And then when they crack. 00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:42.000 It's when they realize that they're trans and they finally see it, they finally understand it. 00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:49.000 I often I think that's a little bit of a violent metaphor, so I don't love that metaphor, but it is a common one people use. 00:27:49.000 --> 00:27:58.000 A metaphor I use is one that I use from, I feel like I've heard this with some of you in the room, so pardon me if I repeat myself. 00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:02.000 It's like ordering a bed off the internet. 00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:07.000 I don't know if you've ever done this order to mattress from the internet. But. 00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:14.000 When it arrives, it's very heavy. You have to get it up the stairs. 00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:21.000 If you have stairs, I had to get mine up the stairs 3 flights. You put it in your living room or if you're smart, you put it in the room where it's going to live. 00:28:21.000 --> 00:28:32.000 And then you open it up. And when you open it up and when, when you. Take open that plastic wrapping. 00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:41.000 The thing goes from fitting in a box that can fit on the truck. To being a king size mattress or whatever size you got. 00:28:41.000 --> 00:28:50.000 And so the way I think about sort of coming to terms with your gender identity is you know, once you open that bed. 00:28:50.000 --> 00:29:04.000 If you opened it in the wrong room If you decide you don't like it. If you decide you need to send it off somewhere else, you you got to do something about it, but you are not putting it back in the box. 00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:13.000 It will not go back in the box. The egg will not return to the broken shell. It expands. 00:29:13.000 --> 00:29:21.000 And enriches life. But for someone like me. I want to say it was kind of a shock to everybody. 00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:35.000 Because when I broke, when I cracked When I realized truths about myself, while it is true that I I looked back through my life history and my story growing up and understood all these signs. 00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:58.000 There's a part in the good place which is a Michael sure comedy where they they 3 4 or 5 of the characters come to one of the characters who's a sort of angel slash demon who is who has set them a particular task and said I found we found all 4 clues you left us to the puzzle we had to solve and he's like that's great. 00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:07.000 I left you 1,200 clues But you found 4, that's great. That's what it feels like when you start looking back through your life, I think, as a trans person, at least for me. 00:30:07.000 --> 00:30:14.000 You start to see things but at the time I didn't have any idea and it was a shock to my parents. 00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:22.000 It was a shock to have lots of people because I No one had seen it coming. 00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:34.000 But the reason I raised that story is because in order for my survival as a trans person. To occur. 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:45.000 I had to have done the work. 10 years, 20 years prior. To love and care for and contain and hold and cherish trans friends. 00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:55.000 Who came out before me. I did not know. At the time that by loving them I was loving myself. 00:30:55.000 --> 00:30:59.000 Because I didn't know myself. 00:30:59.000 --> 00:31:14.000 But love for them is what prepared me to love myself when the time came that I would have to. And so that's when one of the things I say to folks who are maybe still figuring out thinking not sure what they think about issues of transgender. 00:31:14.000 --> 00:31:24.000 Rights or not sure what to do about transgender children, etc, etc, is that you absolutely should build the world now. 00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:38.000 That needs to exist if something surprising were to happen to you tomorrow. Because I want to tell you it is possible to wake up one morning and realize truths about yourself you did not know before. 00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:46.000 It is absolutely. Possible. I want to share one more thing about that because it's something it's something that happened today. 00:31:46.000 --> 00:31:53.000 I've been told as a preacher that The mark of wisdom. Is it being able to have an experience? 00:31:53.000 --> 00:31:59.000 And it not make it into the sermon on Sunday. But make it into the sermon a few months from now. 00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:06.000 To take the time to reflect and process and dwell on that experience. So I'm breaking my rule a little bit by sharing something that happened today. 00:32:06.000 --> 00:32:16.000 But as I was thinking about it, it was so good for what I was trying to say. And it is that It was 78 degrees in Chicago today. 00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:29.000 And I had come to terms with my and settled on she her pronouns and decided that I would own and accept and live an identity as a woman about. 00:32:29.000 --> 00:32:41.000 The end of September last year. And we had a few more 78 degree days before it turned in November, but we didn't have any 78 degrees where I had anything fun to wear. 00:32:41.000 --> 00:32:48.000 That made me feel like myself. And we've had a few 78 degree days where I just haven't felt. 00:32:48.000 --> 00:33:01.000 Like with hormones and everything else that I've had the body that feels right for me. And, but, and we've got, 78 degrees days where those 2 things have been true, but also like I've been at work. 00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:12.000 Or I, and I just haven't gotten to enjoy that. But today, you know, I'm kind of put on my, I put on my shawl because you know I was among the Mennonites. 00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:20.000 I wanted to show a little bit of modesty, but you know this is a sleeveless jumpsuit and I walked around Chicago. 00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:27.000 In this jumpsuit design for the spring on a spring day with long hair. 00:33:27.000 --> 00:33:35.000 Feeling like I was in the body I felt and I realized that one thing I had never understood. Until this afternoon. 00:33:35.000 --> 00:33:42.000 Is what the spring feels like. 00:33:42.000 --> 00:33:52.000 And so the reason I say on this. Is to say that The spring does not depend on your understanding. 00:33:52.000 --> 00:34:01.000 The spring does not dispend on you comprehending what the spring is. The spring does not depend on you. 00:34:01.000 --> 00:34:08.000 But we have a responsibility. As Christians. 00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:14.000 To build a world where everyone can feel the spring. 00:34:14.000 --> 00:34:27.000 World where everyone can notice the miracles around them. And to build a world where we notice the miracles enough that we want to invite others to join in with. 00:34:27.000 --> 00:34:36.000 And so I wanna. And by saying we don't have an obligation to understand. We have an obligation to feel. 00:34:36.000 --> 00:34:48.000 You have a obligation to love. We have an obligation to make straight the path for others to follow. That they may experience the same joy we've experienced. 00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:59.000 And those are the things we really should focus on. In our church communities. One of those things where I think queer theology really does connect to the free church tradition. 00:34:59.000 --> 00:35:12.000 That we each have a story to tell. We're each learning the story we have to tell. We're learning what it means to be in community together and we're trying to figure out how to do it in a way that can give us all hope. 00:35:12.000 --> 00:35:22.000 And comfort and life. And so what I wanted to end with is actually flowing into discussion. Flowing into how we think. 00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:30.000 About these questions. And so the exercise is 3 parts. It's 3 questions for you to think about and for maybe us to answer together. 00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:35.000 I'll let Rachel decide how we do this, but I'll raise the questions and then raise the follow-ups. 00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:48.000 So the first 3 the first part of the the exercise is to think about and name, when was the last time you learned something about yourself? 00:35:48.000 --> 00:36:01.000 When was the last time you learned something about another person? You didn't know. And when was the last time you learned something about God? 00:36:01.000 --> 00:36:16.000 And I think that last one is really. I think it's wild how many people pastors Christians of all ages can't actually name when they feel like they learned something about God. 00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:21.000 But that one's a really interesting question. You may not have an answer, but sit with it. 00:36:21.000 --> 00:36:31.000 But then the follow-up questions are this. For all 3 of those areas. Did anything you learned about yourself? 00:36:31.000 --> 00:36:42.000 Another person or about God make you question. Yourself or your existing knowledge. 00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:48.000 Did anything you learned changed your behavior? 00:36:48.000 --> 00:36:57.000 And this is the kicker. How you love each of these? How did you love? Yourself. 00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:05.000 How did you love another person? And how did you love God? Despite not understanding them entirely. 00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:09.000 Both before and after you learned something about them. 00:37:09.000 --> 00:37:22.000 How did the texture of that love change after you understood something you didn't understand before? Those are the questions I want us to think about because I think those are really the questions we're trying to get at as Christians. 00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:27.000 Who are we? Who are others? Who is God? And how do we live with one another? 00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:33.000 During This world we inhabit where we'll never know everything. 00:37:33.000 --> 00:37:38.000 So that's the questions I want to leave as we go into discussion and I'll let Rachel. 00:37:38.000 --> 00:37:41.000 Discuss with us how we're going to do that. 00:37:41.000 --> 00:37:49.000 Alright, Madison, thank you so much for being here and I'm gonna end the recording and then, we'll talk about whether to break out or stay. 00:37:49.000 --> 00:37:56.000 Altogether. So let me just end recording first.